Curse

myword · Jan 16, 2007, 11:46 PM // 23:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liberations

Excellent, EXCELLENT idea. That idea would solve all problems, guarenteed, and would eliminate the need for touching rank. I think it could be modified, in that that u can form a group of Five, Four, Two, or One and you would be paired up with a group of One, Two or Four or Five, depending how large your party is. Then of course you could have the regular HA, which would be put back to 8v8. Regarding favor, only the the regular 8v8 would give favor, but the semi-random 6v6 would give some sort of other reward. This is an excellent idea! I would like to see ArenaNet give this kind of option some serious thought.

P.S: I do not mean for this new HA to be a substitution, just another OPTION!

you do realise that what you're suggesting is basically a larger party sized random arena right?

Son of Urza · Jan 17, 2007, 03:10 AM // 03:10

No, you could form a party with up to five pre-decided people. You would then be joined by ONE other person who hit the "enter mission" button while alone. If you are alone, you will be joined by five other people of any combination of groups. You could form a group of three and be joined by a group of two and one other person, or almost any number of combinations. Basically, if you wanted to win, you'd make a 5-man build with one optional player slot, and hope that the person you get's good or takes instructions.

YesNo · Jan 17, 2007, 03:39 AM // 03:39

We just want HA back to its original 8v8 form. Not more 'fun ways to get the unranked PvE players involved'. I was unranked at one time, I didn't start the game rank 10 and with a tiger emote, I had to grind my way early on, so why do newer players get to just have an 'easy' way to it?

shardfenix · Jan 17, 2007, 04:21 AM // 04:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lorekeeper

Goodbye players who depend on gimmicks and stale metagames for fame

There will still be morons who play gimmicks to win, there will still be a stale metagame. The only way to discourage gimmicks is to make the HA objectives different. Right now all the maps are either "live" or "run relics." Before, too many slaughter gimmicks (like iway and SF) existed, and now 100% of HA groups play a holding build, which runs scarred earth to average 20 minutes. HA needs maps that not only involve holding to discourage the killing builds, they also need time limit or kill score games to discourage holding builds.

That, of course, should happen after the game is balanced, which won't ever happen. Every update, without fail, Anet has released skills which either don't change the metagame, or make it worse.

The day GW is balanced is the day I give Gaile all my peppermint candy canes.

Detraya fullvear · Jan 17, 2007, 04:29 AM // 04:29

wow... that was a good hour of my life, reading 300 posts. XD.

my ideas.

rank discrimination.

Get over it! i was discriminated against, the people who came before me were discriminated against, and i hope to god the people that come after me are discriminated against. why? Because it made me try to find other groups of people then the people spamming LFM or LFG in ha. it made me make a freinds list, and eventually, it made me pull my own weight, i wasn't dragging a high ranked team down, and they wern't carrying me. If i had to put up with it for 3-4 months to get my balto (i named my wolf :P, hey, at least its better then larry, my bambi, or george, my kitty.), you should to.

6v6 v 8v8.

before i begin, i'd like to say i'm a little biased, as i earned the great majority of my fame 8v8. (ive gotten around 170 6v6 fame).
6v6 is boring!! thier simply isn't room to put everything you need in a build. i simply dont have enough room. its like making gvg builds, and then being forced to work under ta rules.. it sucks from a build creater's point of view. also, as has been said a million times, its supposed to be guildwars, not buildwars. bring back 8v8 please

.

New map changes.

YES! gvg, ta, and even ra gets new maps every expansion... where is the ha love? i love this idea. i also love the beta test weekend idea. i, however, think it should happen in an 8v8 environment. granted, youd never know if 8v8 or the map changes brought more popularity.

all and all.

i think a-net has done an amazing job so far at keeping this game balanced, and has, the majority of times (im willing to forgive 6v6 if they fix it), done an amazing job.

Wildkat · Jan 17, 2007, 04:55 AM // 04:55

Woot bring back 8v8 so I can reinstall GW!!!!!The timing for 6v6 was really bad(never was able to try 8v8 with Nightfall out).Maybe some of the suggestions that were in the original 8v8 vs 6v6 hype will be used.Having separate arenas for 8v8 and 6v6 and maybe alternate between 8v8 and 6v6.The patch to change the size of the teams took about one minute....the minute that will live in infamy.

notrich · Jan 17, 2007, 05:08 AM // 05:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by YesNo

We just want HA back to its original 8v8 form. Not more 'fun ways to get the unranked PvE players involved'. I was unranked at one time, I didn't start the game rank 10 and with a tiger emote, I had to grind my way early on, so why do newer players get to just have an 'easy' way to it?

Grind is over rated - why not use an active ranking system - like plus/minus: suggested in this thread: http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10101731

Would love comments added to that thread pro/con. This type of rank system would eliminate rank inflation - it would be a measure of "current" skill (as opposed to accumulated skill).

I stop in HoH occasionally, and unless you want to put together a random pug (or went there with most of a team already filled out) - You are in for a nice long wait to play (unless you are R3+). Waiting for players who fit the build your trying to put together. Or god forbid - join a group - ping your skill bar and have someone scream "OMFG NoOb!"

Atara Ars Namadra · Jan 17, 2007, 06:52 AM // 06:52

This looks promising... Im a PvE player who would love to try HA but cant due to my lack of rank! I hope this fixes the issue and allows a larger variety of builds to be used

manaleak34 · Jan 17, 2007, 07:33 AM // 07:33

My opinion on everything.

Rank Discrimination.
Personally I think this has always been nothing but whining. You want to get into HA groups? Join in with Guild/Alliance players or your friends list. Or even start your own party if you want to! I'm currently at Rank 1 and I still play plenty of HA thanks to Guild groups.

6v6 Vs 8v8

Personally I prefer the 6v6 and I am confused why there is so much hate towards it. If your complaining about Holding builds, please stop. Theres way around them if you know what your doing and not everyone runs them. It's just a thing called the metagame. Popular builds change. What everyone may be running last week may not be around at all next week.

But I think we can make the perfect compromise...7v7 :P

Div · Jan 17, 2007, 08:10 AM // 08:10

I don't see why everyone is saying this change will give PvE people a chance to try out HA in an even playing field. There's still going to be rank discrimination regardless, and even the poor rank9's will be discriminated against by the r12+ :P

Jamison0071 · Jan 17, 2007, 09:38 AM // 09:38

I agree that 6v6 means most classes don't have a chance in HA nowadays. I would love to see the return on 8v8!

Tsumi · Jan 17, 2007, 09:50 AM // 09:50

I'm glad that ya'll are finally doing this "Let us know what you think" thing. In a way it really shows that you do care what our opinions are about a skill or a build. I some how wish that ya'll had done this earlier before the nerfing of many other things. Though i am still kinda new to HA I have heard lots of people talking about going back to the 8 vs 8. Though i wasn't doing HA at that time i can see how the implamentations for that many players was a good thing. I know some of you wish it was more but this might cause a problem with the servers. anyways just wanted to add my thoughts.. good luck

Xeeron · Jan 17, 2007, 11:46 AM // 11:46

Having played GW since the very first E3foreveryone weekend, I really hope that 6vs6 stays. 8vs8 was totally inferior to GvG and lead to massive movement of good PvP players out of HA. Going back to 8vs8 will bring back gimmic builds that dominate HA and make the game boring for everyone.

- Xeeron

Deleet · Jan 17, 2007, 11:56 AM // 11:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by notrich

Grind is over rated - why not use an active ranking system - like plus/minus: suggested in this thread: http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10101731

Would love comments added to that thread pro/con. This type of rank system would eliminate rank inflation - it would be a measure of "current" skill (as opposed to accumulated skill).

I stop in HoH occasionally, and unless you want to put together a random pug (or went there with most of a team already filled out) - You are in for a nice long wait to play (unless you are R3+). Waiting for players who fit the build your trying to put together. Or god forbid - join a group - ping your skill bar and have someone scream "OMFG NoOb!"

Rank is not accumulated skill in that form. It's accumulated experience. Not the same thing. We already have an accumulated skill ranking, GvG rankings

But you propose a individually skill rank? - Intresting.

Alleji · Jan 17, 2007, 04:32 PM // 16:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atara Ars Namadra

This looks promising... Im a PvE player who would love to try HA but cant due to my lack of rank! I hope this fixes the issue and allows a larger variety of builds to be used

It won't fix this so-called "rank discrimination" because rank discrimination is simply experienced players wanting to play with other experienced players. If you're not ranked, you have no experience in HA and I don't see why you're whining about it instead of getting that experience.

Balanced builds have absolutely nothing to do with it. If anything, lack of gimmicks will make it harder for you to get your bambi. Unranked balanced groups do much worse than unranked gimmicks, because gimmicks are easier to learn and play.

Bastian · Jan 17, 2007, 04:53 PM // 16:53

I just want to let all the people QQing over rank discrimination know something:

My brother, who plays GW, has only been playing for like 3-4 months. He recently joined our guild in order to get into PvP. He is r0 and we are all r5+. He has very little elites and skills unlocked. However, on our forums we have a place where we post builds that are used often in PvP. we suggested running around in TA and RA to gain experience and unlock skills. Guess what? He unlocked Heroe's Ascent 2 days into that, and began running as a thumper for unranked teams. In the last week or two he been to Halls (although I don't think he's won) and gained a fair amount of fame. And the best part was - he accepted it and didn't cry about not getting into ranked teams.

The problem with PvE players trying to get into HA is they go as a W/Mo and spam "Tank Lfg!". Guess what - you actually advertised "Noob Lfg!" I would suggest finding out what builds are typically run in HA - use observer mode - and then advertise soemthing like "Rao LFG". Then have the right skills to ping when they ask you - or at least the basic skills, most teams will want you to tweak your build a little based on what they are running.

If my brother can do this without a problem - so can you.

P.S. Download TS and Vent - they're free.

Razz L Dazzle · Jan 17, 2007, 07:10 PM // 19:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bastian

I just want to let all the people QQing over rank discrimination know something:

My brother, who plays GW, has only been playing for like 3-4 months. He recently joined our guild in order to get into PvP. He is r0 and we are all r5+. He has very little elites and skills unlocked. However, on our forums we have a place where we post builds that are used often in PvP. we suggested running around in TA and RA to gain experience and unlock skills. Guess what? He unlocked Heroe's Ascent 2 days into that, and began running as a thumper for unranked teams. In the last week or two he been to Halls (although I don't think he's won) and gained a fair amount of fame. And the best part was - he accepted it and didn't cry about not getting into ranked teams.

The problem with PvE players trying to get into HA is they go as a W/Mo and spam "Tank Lfg!". Guess what - you actually advertised "Noob Lfg!" I would suggest finding out what builds are typically run in HA - use observer mode - and then advertise soemthing like "Rao LFG". Then have the right skills to ping when they ask you - or at least the basic skills, most teams will want you to tweak your build a little based on what they are running.

If my brother can do this without a problem - so can you.

P.S. Download TS and Vent - they're free.

/agree

If you don't have rank or PvP title why would you expect to play in the top groups? Like anything else, new HA and pvpers have to get the necessary experience to move up in HA. Learn popular build and the skills used, read forums, join with friends or an HA or PvP guild. Some people will find this transtion easy and become ranked quickly and develop a good friends list, others will not. It is a competitive arena afterall. For those that have to grind fame in small amounts, make friends, watch observer and try to make a few fame each day until you reach your goals. I remember when i started just hoping to get into one good group a week to make 10-20 fame run to help me get R3. Getting rank can be a slow process but you'll get experience and friends along the way to help you.

Renegade26 · Jan 17, 2007, 08:01 PM // 20:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alleji

Because it wouldn't count as gaining experience in HA?

It would teach you same skills as random arenas + map sequence, if you can get past the first map. I don't think you'd even learn any tactics because an RA team can't use tactics. They can ctrl+call an enemy monk and wail on him.

If you are playing and even losing inside a Random version of HA, then you are gaining HA experience. Maps and objectives is what makes HA and TA different, as well as the team sizes, so this allows people with no experience to get it without any hassle. When they feel theyre good enough after getting through many stages then they should have a good amount of fame and knowledge to do the real HA. Just a method to allow people to get more experience.

Maybe an extra addition to keep this Random Ascent fair, only allow certain vetted builds to be used there. Yes it denies creativity, but Random Ascent shouldn't be made for farming noobs at HA with some pro build that you copied from guildwiki, it should be there to help people that can't make or join groups.

Jadite Knight · Jan 17, 2007, 08:02 PM // 20:02

As a long time avid fan of the game, i would like to say...

First off, it will be exciting to see what kind of changes get made to Hero's Ascent. Going from an 8-player format to a 6-player format and dismissing a map was met with mixed reviews, but it opened up some usefulness for other classes, and that allowed for many new builds. (check out gwshack.us for an onslaught list)

Secondly, everyone has been a victim of rank comparison, lord knows i used to be, but the fact remains that most successful groups are those that are primarily guild groups or groups that tend to play together on a regular basis. And if anyone has ever observed popular groups like [치치치치] [ffs] or [US], you will tend to see either a guest or alliance member in the roster. It can be said that if you; make friends, dont flame or rage quit, practice multiple classes, then its more than likely that if a talented group has a need for a specific class, chances are, they are going to check a friends list before grabbing an unknown ranked person. So build up a list of friends you enjoy pvping with.

As far as any major changes that i would like to see...

There are literally hundreds of skills and skill combinations to choose from. And most skill balances come for a good reason. But how cool would it be if the number of skills in your skill bar were increased to 10, and you could carry 1 elite for your primary and 1 elite for your secondary? Hmm, now that would be pretty interesting...

Renegade26 · Jan 17, 2007, 08:08 PM // 20:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Detraya fullvear

wow... that was a good hour of my life, reading 300 posts. XD.

rank discrimination.

Get over it! i was discriminated against, the people who came before me were discriminated against, and i hope to god the people that come after me are discriminated against. why? Because it made me try to find other groups of people then the people spamming LFM or LFG in ha. it made me make a freinds list, and eventually, it made me pull my own weight, i wasn't dragging a high ranked team down, and they wern't carrying me. If i had to put up with it for 3-4 months to get my balto (i named my wolf :P, hey, at least its better then larry, my bambi, or george, my kitty.), you should to.

Tbh, a lot of people who started the game when it was released were all in the same boat, so there couldn't be any discrimination against each other. Maybe you did work hard to get a rank 3 so you could work hard to rank 6, and so on, but some people want to play HA for fun, with the extra bonus of a rank and emote. So far this isn't possible because of all the elitism and the gimicky and unbalanced builds. No1 is asking them to be dragged to rank 6, they are asking to be accepted.